"Queen Bee"

[ritaxis]

When you assert that a woman gets away with a behavior because she has a "queen bee thing" going on, what are you saying about her? What is the equivalent language you would use for talking about a man? Is there an equivalent concept? If so, why can't I think of it? If not, why?

Context is, as James Nicoll says, for the weak.

Comments

[nancylebov.livejournal.com]

If it's a short man, you can talk about a Napoleon complex.

I hadn't heard about the queen bee thing. Is it about seeking power or about getting away with behavior?

[ritaxis.livejournal.com]

In this particular case, it's asserting that nobody will criticize the woman in question for her failure to behave in a sufficiently upright way, because she has a queen bee thing going on.

It's interesting that your comparison is to a way of speaking about short men. It reinforces the thought I've been having that it's a kind of criticism reserved for people who have or attempt to have power that they're structurally not supposed to have.

[heleninwales.livejournal.com]

It may be a US/UK difference, but I've never heard the "queen bee" description linked to justifying bad behaviour. Just that it describes a (most likely) self-appointed bossy, organising sort of woman who always wants to be in charge.

So the contexts where I've heard the phrase would be more like, "She always has to be queen bee." Probably said of a woman who is trying to organise something, even if it was running fine without her help.

[ritaxis.livejournal.com]

Oh no, I was unclear. The person isn'ty justifying the other person's behavior, he's amplifying the accusation of bad behavior by saying that others won't ciritcize it because of her queen bee status. So it's more like the usage you're talking about, though it's less about the practical running of things than merely being deferred to, I think.

[heleninwales.livejournal.com]

No, actually, I was being unclear because "justify" wasn't the right word but I couldn't think of the right one and let it slide.

In my usage, the group don't necessarily agree that the queen bee is in fact the queen and therefore don't necessarily defer, though I could see that in some situations they may do. But then I've noticed that I tend never to get near the centre of any group, especially cliquey groups. I'm always on the fringes and it has been known for me to be a member of two groups, the leaders and the core members of which dislike one another but I flit happily between them, never getting deeply involved with either.

[al-zorra.livejournal.com]

I believe they say that silly thing taken from wolves that doesn't exist in nature: "alpha male."

[tavella.livejournal.com]

Well, alpha male and female do exist, it's just that it's not actually a big complicated social dominance and challenge and mobility thing, it's Mom and Dad and then everyone else, who are usually their children. It's a genuine thing among canids, just not in the deformed sense observed in captive artificial wolf packs.

[boxofdelights]

If I heard that, my first thought would be that she has charisma, a mysterious quality that makes people want to please her. I say it is mysterious because even when I feel it too, I don't know what it is that is making me feel that way.

After the book Queen Bees and Wannabees (which inspired the movie Mean Girls), the phrase "Queen Bee" makes me think of the kinds of bullying that were talked about in that book: gossip, mocking, shunning; mostly verbal and always done in groups. Here, the bullying behaviors can be identified, but the source of the power to choose a target and get others to want to hurt that target is still mysterious.

If you're thinking of the same case I'm thinking of, someone threatened to drop the internet on my head for publicly disagreeing with her. I apologized and shut the fuck up, because she does in fact have that power.

[ritaxis.livejournal.com]

I don't actually think I am, because I don't remember seeing your name there at all. But I could be wrong, because I came late to the story as usual.

[kalmn.livejournal.com]

Cult of personality. Which I use for women as well.

[matrixmann]

Taking the meanings that the urbandictionary gives out - perhaps the sort of like Biff from Back To The Future corresponds a little to it.
Even though it's not the same.
He suppresses the weak, gets small when a person of authority is telling him he has more pull and the only one he ever takes really serious is only himself. Including he has some weaker spirits that always accompany him and everyone seems to admire him (secretly) because no-one wants to get into trouble with him.
Sort of like "a bully" which always drags a retinue behind himself.
If you can find that in the real world...

[tavella.livejournal.com]

To me, it's someone who is deliberately manipulating things to be on top of a social heirarchy. It's something I see in both male and female, but I can't think of an exact equivalent in a male-coded word.

[thomasyan.livejournal.com]

I think I saw the discussion that prompted your question. I am not sure that usage is standard.

[zeborah]

To me, you'd be saying that you're a pickup artist and she hasn't swooned at your feet.

I can't think of equivalent genderswapped language because the genderswapped scenario doesn't really have a place in our society.